Ie not vegan@lemmy.world.
Edit: I am going to try to start my own for now here https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/plantbased
What do you mean by “militant and rude?”
I always wonder where people are going that this seems so common. I’ve been relatively low meat for a while, what’s called half-vegetarian/flexatarian. My experience is that most vegans/vegetarians just want to share their favorite recipe.
In my experience, this usually comes from people defending half-measures, which is fundamentally wrong from the vegan point of view, and thus the claws come out. If you aren’t going against the “correct” stance, vegans are very chill, as someone who is low meat as well I am working on eradicating that (which at this point is more of a social problem than individual).
This attitude is the entire problem. You know exactly what OP means, but you pretend like the reputation the vegan community has nothing to do with the community itself.
Previously I found that they were staunchly anti-anything but vegan and carried over said rudeness from the reddit communities. As a vegan myself it was a big turn off. I asked about this and they banned me. Reminiscent of lemmygrad on anything but their specific MLM ideology.
Not accepting that people need time to adjust and maybe go vegan in smaller steps. There is even hostility towards people who look for fake meat or dare to say they like the taste of meat even though they still want to avoid eating it. Just generally being assholes and gatekeepers.
This is a natural consequence of always being attacked by non-vegans, patience is thin and communities are maintained by the ones who remain. Unlike, say, gaming, veganism is constantly attacked, so it’s harder for them to be more inclusive than a gaming community would be.
Also, a lot of people that join fringe movements have a personality that craves conflict, and it becomes an outlet for it.
Non-carnism isn’t really so fringe anymore, but that’s pretty new, and may not have reached veganism specifically.
Seems a bit like a vicious circle to me. Hate against vegans leading to a hateful reaction, leading to vegans being perceived as assholes, leading to more hate against vegans etc. I guess it’s understandable, but it also seems counterproductive for spreading veganism.
Anecdotally, as a vegetarian I can say that the most vicious attacks against my lifestyle were not by meat eaters but some vegans (online-vegans to be precise, all I’ve met IRL were nice people). That’s despite me certainly never attacking veganism, I even think it’s morally superior to vegetarianism.
I really think this is an incredibly insightful take. I can’t say I hang out in many vegan specific corners of the Internet, but I know there is a very active and vocal segment of the Internet community that’s anti-vegan, I’ve heard stories of coordinated brigading attempts against vegan communities on the Internet.
I’d imagine it would be almost impossible to run an open and welcoming community when you are getting constantly inundated with hate messages, eventually it would become incredibly difficult to discern between a user who has genuine curiosity and one who is asking bad faith questions in order to trigger some kind of debate.
At this point in time you couldn’t pay me to become a mod in one of those communities, it really seems like a no win scenario.
That’s been my experience too. I’m trying to eat less meat and find alternatives that work for me, but it apparently has to be all or fuck you for some. I know it’s not everyone, but somehow they seem the loudest and it’s not very helpful.
Right now, nowhere on lemmy that I’ve found.
Mind you, it isn’t every person, but all the vegan communities and instances are currently run by militants of some degree. The .world one is the least militant that I’ve run across.
They aren’t all rude, but definitely have the kind of thinking that leads to rudeness eventually.
Which really sucks because there’s plenty of really chill vegans on lemmy. But you can’t talk to them in vegan spaces without it being a problem unless you’re parroting the scripture of vegan to their satisfaction.
Being real, I kinda wish someone would start a decent relaxed community.
Wasn’t .world the only one where an admin decided to go on a rampage?
Nah, just the most egregious incident. And even that only got attention because it’s such a big instance.
I will try now at https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/c/plantbased
Is vegan cat food allowed?
I wrote a reply then saw your other comment and realized you’re just arguing
Pretty sure my other comment was a well thought out discussion of moral absolutism versus harm reduction. My ethics are relativist, even leaning towards moral skepticism. If you are not acquainted with these concepts then that’s fine but it’s a real position that many hold which creates a valid lens for why veganism (or really, all universalist ethics) tends to attract militants. Not “just arguing” which is you being dismissive. And kind of rude.
I don’t mean to be rude but you come to a post asking about good vegan subs saying why it’s wrong. Read the room
Like I said, I am just sharing a lens which attempts to analyze why these communities are like this. I am personally about 2/3 vegan, but find most vegan communities insufferable and felt like I had relevant perspective to share.
The idea of not eating meat isn’t “wrong,” and i never said sny such thing. Again, as a moral skeptic, that’s like saying “not eating meat is blue.” It’s a meaninglass statement.
Then I’m sorry, your first two comments made me think otherwise. I’ve been seeing a lot of toxicity and bad actors recently.
I agree with you from a personal diet perspective and as a Buddhist, I don’t think it’s wrong. I do think there are ethical virtues and it benefits many beings from not eating animal products though :)
Thanks for taking the rudeness claim seriously! :) I fully agree with you.
Previously I started a plant based community on Lemmy.world maybe I will try to actually be active. You’ve inspired me
I just want to say I love militant vegans, so long as militant means they are organized and actively creating the world they want to live in. if they are just preaching, I would not say they are militant, just evangelical.
and, to be clear, I’m neither. I just find militancy admirable.
How do you see vegans organizing and creating this world without preaching? How do you spread an ethical diet? Like that one dude saying struggle sessions and party line… for a diet, what
they can organize among themselves. affinity groups that practice direct action are like my favorite political orgs.
Direct action? You’re implying something beyond ethics and diet. But what? Honestly don’t know! ;)
animal liberation front did some good work. earth liberation front, just stop oil… you get the idea I hope
